Kelly Reynolds

Today, I want to introduce you to someone I adore. We met a while back in the DOO certification. And I love talking to her. And I'm super excited for this interview today. So please welcome Rachel Pereyra. Rachel. Hello, how are you?

 

Rachel Pereyra

Thank you, Kelly, for having me. I'm excited to be here and talk with you.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

I am super excited. I love this. I used to see Rachel's face every week for I think, what three months, I was the agency coach and the director of ops certification when Rachel is going through, and I loved it. It was like the best group we all stayed. We all have a voxer channel together still and love it. So, so excited to have you here today. So can you tell everyone a little bit about you and your business? So we kind of know that jist of what's going on?

 

Rachel Pereyra 

Yeah, so I joined this online business rat race in 2020. My business is technically a pandemic, baby, like so many others. I was freelancing before the pandemic as like a virtual assistant kind of like, whatever, basically whatever work I could find that would pay me money, like, let's be honest, and when the pandemic hit, and I started working from home, and it just started making me reevaluate everything, I decided to go full time on my business by the end of 2020. So I've been full time for almost two years now. I have an Operations Support Agency, we transitioned into an agency model about a year ago was left with finishing all the coaching with the DOO certification and Kelly. And it's just been a speeding railroad car on fire since like, you know, great, super fun, but also really fast. And the first year as an agency owner, I feel like they don't warn you enough that it is absolute insanity. Knowing so many friends who have agencies, they're all like, Oh, it's okay. I just want to quit my business every day. And I'm like, ha ha, they're like, no, like, that was us warning you. And I was like, oh, okay, cool. Yeah,

 

Kelly Reynolds 

I didn't get that. I didn't know.

 

Rachel Pereyra 

I thought we were being funny. Like, I thought this was sarcasm. So yeah, I have an operation support Agency. We provide process, Team tech support for growing businesses in the online world and also now in nonprofit organization space.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

Awesome. I love it. I love how honest Rachel is I'm sure that this next episode, this episode today is going to be a very blunt episode. Because we both are very upfront about talking that kind of thing. You know what I mean? It is, it's hard, right? This is hard. And we have to have this conversation before about how people online like to sell things. And they like to make it sound easy. So you know, easily get restart your business and get to six figures, it's going to be so easy. Or just follow my checklist and you'll be a millionaire or like all those ridiculous things. And it's not, it's not easy. And I think that especially now when, you know doom and gloom, people out there like Oh, recession and all this kind of stuff. Whether that really applies to anything at all. Like, all of a sudden everyone's like, Oh, I don't really? I didn't know it's gonna be hard. Right? I'm hearing. I didn't know it was gonna be hard. I'm out. Like you're like, Well, yeah, no one told you today.

 

Rachel Pereyra 

Yep. Yep. I feel like I have a lot of colleagues and friends who are like, I'm looking for a job now. And I get it. Yeah. Two years it like if you started, especially if you started your business during the pandemic, like a lot of us, myself included, it was kind of like that was our option, because our corporate job wasn't working out with kids or life or, you know, Panorama childcare was not fun. And so now you have the chance to go back. And from what I've seen, like a lot of employers are valuing that entrepreneurship like you didn't, like you spent the last two years working really hard and you're like, ooh, we could use that, you know, but I just I think we're seeing in my opinion, there's like a reckoning of sorts happening in the online business space if people realizing now just how like it doesn't end like you it's not. I come from finance and sales. So I understand that like you have goals every day, every week, every month, every quarter every Are you here until like you finish a goal for the month, and then you take a breath and then start to get. And so like, I'm kind of used to, I guess the psychology you have to get yourself into to have goals like that. And so when you have a business, it's the same way, like you have a sales goal, like you want to make that 20k month, you've hit the 20k month, that's what like two days and then it's started all over again. Gotta hit it again.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

Right? Like all of a sudden, it's the first of the month again, and you're like, okay, yeah, start again. Yeah, I mean, I'm Wall Street. Same thing, like I understand like Apple like, it's, you're always hitting some kind of sales number you're always selling, or you're always kind of pushing to do something. And I think that that's, that's a lot of a lie we've been sold in a lot of places is just do this thing. And you can have passive income and then go to the beach. Like, yep, I go to the beach a bunch. But I work hard to there's, there's like, so I try my very best to not give that impression. Like I'm on a paddleboard on Friday, because I made that meeting time because of my sanity, but I was definitely working Saturday afternoon or something you don't mean like trying to juggle all the things. So I think I do what I want. And that is what I think that we both agree is should be happening. But that's not what sold. And I feel bad for a lot of our friends who got here and said, oh shit, I don't, I don't want to keep going. Yeah, I just want it to start, I want it to just keep running. I don't want to keep getting clients, I don't want to keep building things I don't want. And it's exhausting.

 

Rachel Pereyra 

Ya know, and I will say the agency model does have like a lot more of that pressure, a lot more of that constant, like elbow grease needed from you. Because until you've reached a place where your revenue is like stable, good numbers, and you can bring in your own like internal duo ops manager person, like that's you, especially if you have an operations agency. That's you. And so you know, when a client folder needs a new template, or you know, when one of your team members is struggling to update things and click up on time, like all of those things as you and I think that's the thought load that's not talked about enough, it's beyond just like, we're all ops people like, we can set up on Zapier and click up and dubsado and make it all flow. But then in real life, when it's happening, there's still that thought load of okay, well, did you know that so and so's contract gets signed on time, like did the invoice consent? And that's the kind of pieces that don't stop being your problem, because it's still your business. Even if it's automated, and it's happening, you're still thinking about it?

 

Kelly Reynolds  

Yeah, I think it's very similar to that, like the load they say moms have where they're always wondering if the laundry was done. If they have milk for breakfast, like they're your brain is never shutting off. And that is, in one way, like a superpower. And that's why we're so good at ops, because we're always constantly thinking of all the things need to get done, right. That's why everything runs well. But at the same time, it's exhausting. And it's very hard to shut off, which is why I go paddleboarding and go gardening because I need to be able to do things that shut off that brain because it does not want to shut off. It's

 

Rachel Pereyra  

You have to.

 

Kelly Reynolds  

Yeah, because otherwise you're gonna see you don't sleep. Right, like, last episodes or a couple of weeks ago, I don't even know what episode it was actually, at this point. At seven was I was talking about how this client is selling his business and like all the sudden everything goes crazy. And it's one of those things where I could have said no, but not really. And this is my business. And I have to get in there like I'm in there like making copies of things that have filters. Yeah. Do I run an agency? Sure. But does the work have to get done? And I had to jump in? Yep. Like that's kind of the where it is. Right? If someone leaves and you've got to cover something, I tend to be the one to get in there. So I'll ask you this, because I think this plays into this. How is your team structure? Do you have many layers? Is it you managing the team? Do you have do an ops manager something like that? Like, how is it structured?

 

Rachel Pereyra 

This is a great question. So currently, at time of recording, the purpose of my saying that I have, I am my own internal ops manager right now. I have a layer of subcontractors, I have a couple people who I would consider project leads who can you know, manage the deliverables. So like, I'll set the scope and the deliverables and then they'll manage it and come to meet for some problem. But I have gotten to a place where we do we have had some projects that I've not involved in the deliverables on which is my career. And, like really, like very honestly, biggest win of my career. And but a lot of the projects I'm still directly involved in in some capacity, because of the nature of the work and like my skill sets still like I haven't replaced it yet within my business. So I have it's mostly just subcontractors. My internal team is very, very lean. I think it will be surprised to know, it's me, Heather, my office coordinator and a copywriter. That's my internal team. That's it. So that means everything not listed by copywriter as coordinator is me. And so those have actually been Believe it or not strategic decision. ads for those last year. So I could spend a lot of investment in learning everything that needs to go into running the agency from every angle. And before hiring out, so I know, you know, better expectations. So there's my conscious decision. But it also has made my growth slow. Because like, people who knew me before I started agency are like, Oh, my God, you've grown so fast overnight, but it's also made it slow. Because I can only sell so much.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

I can only only so much bandwidth, right? 

 

Rachel Pereyra 

Yeah. Because I'm still so involved in everything. So until like, I get out of it. I have like, a client ceiling, so to speak.

 

Kelly Reynolds

Okay, so you, you have made this this decision on purpose of like you being in the business more. And I think this is a very hot topic in agencies, because some people are like, Oh, you can only run an agency if you're out of the work. And I am with you in a way that I have made those decisions on purpose to stay in some of the work for either being able to move money into a different place, or there wasn't a ton of work there. I could do it faster. For this thing, like there was a reason I kept that because it was easier, or because it was financially motivating. Or I spent more money on coaching than I did on internal team members, because that's what I wanted to do. Rachel's laughing at me right now, because she's exactly the same way. Because these are the decisions I wanted to make. And instead of everyone saying, Well, you have to do this right? Love. People love to do that. Well, an agency is only an agency if you do it this way, which I hate. I did the same thing. So is there a plan for you to stay here for now? Do you have a plan to get out of everything? Like where do you see all this going? In the short or long term?

 

Rachel Pereyra 

Yeah, no, this is a well timed interview. Because I am, I feel like now it's been a year, like doing it all, still selling, leading the team, marketing candling different clients like all of those pieces. So now I can see, this has always been I've always been a get paid to play kind of person like I like to, if I know I can deliver on it, I'll offer it and I'll see if I like it. And so we've done that with the agency. And so we're currently restructuring our offers a bit to enable the team to be able to deliver without so much direct input for me, because I have pros on my team. Like, I only hire experts. And so I want them to be empowered to deliver it. Which means that some of that special sauce that lives in my brain, the clients pay me for it needs to be written down very clearly. That's what I'm, that's what I'm working on is getting it to where I can step back out of that, because I've realized over the last year that sales is not an area I could step out of yet. So like making those plans is to get me out of the deliverable piece for clients. But then I can stay like focused on sales and marketing, and just managing the team and not have to be like, not like there's nothing worse than your project manager opinion and be like, Hey, I'm so we had this do on Friday, and it was like Wednesday. So are you gonna like put your part in? And did I, my hiring my own boss? I did. I did. It's good. I need it. But also, like, that's been something that I want to get out of, like I enjoy, I'm back to a place now where I'm enjoying having a couple of one to one clients that I work with without the agency involved. And so I'm adjusting my bandwidth accordingly. Because like you said, for me a lot of the decision was financially motivated to because, I mean, I was a primary breadwinner and my family going into the pandemic, and then I had to leave my job. And so my business has had to support my family from day one. So I've always been like very financially driven a lot of pressure. So it is. And so when I started the agency, I was like, I'd been kinda I hadn't matched my corporate salary fully yet, like revenue wise, yes. income wise now, which we should know the difference. That's a whole separate. We'll talk about that a minute. Right. And so going into the agency, it was very conscious of the fact that I'm not going to do all this work, and continue like, underpaying myself. And so I've been working to pay myself more. And I've also invested a lot in coaching. It's an I choose coaches who are mentors, like who've been there, done that before me, so that I can really learn. And so I worked with two coaches at a high level, one of them were just wrapping up a year together. And the other one I did a accelerator program with her. And I learned so much from them that now I'm in the implementation stage. So taking the rest of 2022 off of coaching to implement.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

Yeah, I think that that's what you have to we have to talk about that because there's a whole thing like I love to talk about delegation, right, getting it off your plate, you're not the best person for this, but there is something to be said for not delegating everything, just because. Right, like you and I, we need to, like I wanted to bring the money into my house, instead of only taking a part of that money and then paying someone else for it on certain things, there are certain things I really just like to do still, I didn't want to become the CEO of my business that only markets and looks at financials, you don't feel like, that's fun at all. But like, that's not all. Like, that's not what I love to do. I like to, you know, makes SOPs and pretty spreadsheets and things like that. Like, I didn't want to lose everything. So I intentionally made that decision as well. And I also I wanted to be around for my kid, I wanted to be able to like, go places and, and take him this morning, I dropped him off at camp, like I want to be able to do those things. And that has been a conscious decision as well. Away from faster growth and more toward if you had it on a scale like more toward a lifestyle I want. Like, there's a good amount of Friday's that I'm either on a paddleboard or I'm with a drink of my hand at the beach, because Fridays in summer, that's what that means around here. And that is what I've built, because that's what I wanted, even if it meant less fast growth. You know what I mean? I think that's where you

 

Rachel Pereyra

Oh, yeah, no, for the last year, I've had what I call Fuckit- Mondays, because I hate Mondays. Like it's, I'm sure it's an old corporate mentality. But they've been like, they started out as CEO days. And then they became my, like, mental break days. And so sometimes I'll do like, sometimes I'll make a bunch of reels and write a bunch of emails sequences or, or social media posts, or set up performance reviews for the team. And sometimes I will binge watch old reality TV shows while I eat popcorn, and whatever 

 

Kelly Reynolds

you got to do, right? 

 

Rachel Pereyra

Yeah. And it's been for the last year, it's been an intentional, like, I'm really protected that time is like, that's my time. And so it's been really good to have that. And I feel like it's what enabled me to get through the first year of craziness, was having that timer. I was like, just gotta make it's Monday. Just gotta make it to Monday. And so having that space is so important. I'm restructuring my weeks now and letting go. One days Oh, no, it's for. It's for a reason that I'm really happy with and it means I'll be able to restructure my work weeks to be more present as we go back into the school year with the kids because they've been home all summer. So I haven't like truly had my Mondays anyway. Because like we're hanging out.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

That's allowed and they do things all they want to do things all day.

 

Rachel Pereyra 

Yes, no. Are they? There? They always want to do things. I love them. Can you watch me play this game? Can Can we look good? But I'm working.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

Look at what I put one more like one look at it now. Look at it now. Yes, yeah, we get that here too. Yeah. That's why camp is worth every dollar. So as we're talking about this, so we were talking about the team and the finances around that and the decisions we're making. So how are you looking at? Like the finances in your agency? Because we were just mentioning this a little bit. So I'd love to get into it. How are you paying your team? How are you deciding what you're spending money on? Like, how are you working that in your business? 

 

Rachel Pereyra

Yeah, so when I started the agency and very intentionally wanted to pay my team, above average for an operations agency. And so I went into that into it with that intention. So they they invoice me every month for whatever hours they used, or if they're on a project, right, whatever the project was. I actually good tip for those of you who do Coronavirus, right. We don't do proffers I made a separate bank account called subcontractor payment holding. And so when a client pays me, I pull out the portion of that that's going to the team and just put it away. So I'm not looking at it. I don't see that it doesn't exist. I don't have it.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

Just like I know that way. It's out. It's not yours. Yep. Yeah, that way.

 

Rachel Pereyra 

I know. Like at the end of the month, there's always money in there. So like no matter what craziness, I've signed up for coaching programs, there's money to pay the day and ever people

 

Kelly Reynolds 

People really like to get paid. Like I've found that Yeah. Like, I know, it's crazy,

 

Rachel Pereyra  

right? But people want their invoices paid on time. That's my other thing. And my other tip is, I don't have and this is something that some friends have said, I don't have like a in with me on this date. I'm always very cautious around the small contractor employee differentiation from like, just it was me once a month, preferably on the first like, but you know, most of them invoice me on the first because you know, every wants to get paid. And so then I just set aside time on the first and the second to just pay all their invoices, like when they're received as much as possible, because I find people love that too. Like they really do, right? Like think about when we for those of you listening like when you send an invoice to a client and they pay it within an hour you're like, ooh, favorite client, like right? I gotta be favorite. Yeah, that's how that's how I structure that.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

So do you pay them retainers? Are you paying them after the fact on the work? I'm just curious to see after the fact. Yes. So I do as well, which I didn't know if other people did. This is why we're doing this series because I really just want to know how other people do their stuff.

 

Rachel Pereyra 

When I first started, I would, I would have the new team members for the first month invoice me their first month ahead of time, like, and then I realized that that's not sustainable because typically client hasn't paid their invoice yet. And also, that doesn't protect me very well. If someone were to like, oh, great, I got my invoice by you because it's your first month. And so I said that I invoice after the work. And I'm guaranteeing you're like, that's a benefit of working on agency. We're like, I'm guarantee you're getting paid. And it's my job to get the money from the client. And so it's worked out really well that way is to have them invoice me after the fact. But I do ask for monthly invoices. Unless it's like a set project rate. But typically, I feel like I don't want people to go working more than a month without getting paid. Because I do feel like psychologically, you lose motivation. Even when someone's not like a bad team member, like you just start to lose motivation. So I asked them to invoice me every month, even if it's just like a partial from a project because I want them to get paid every month I have my clients pay me every month like it just makes sense.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

Yeah, I haven't right now that I need their hours for any, like any client work that's hourly, they have to have hours so that I can invoice because some of them are 1st and the 15th. And then they're like, Well, why would I just invoice you now? Because all the hours are in, we all know what's going on. So that's kind of how it is? Do you find there's a resistance to having people work and get paid afterward? Because I feel like so many of us preach like you should get paid ahead of time with retainers. But a lot of times if you are working with an agency and getting that subcontractor work, it's kind of hard to match up that like retainer money. That retainer money with the hours worked on clients. So do you find there's resistance to being paid afterward?

 

Rachel Pereyra  

Not now, when I originally started, there were some people who were a little nervous, they were okay with it. But I think I've established I've made a name for myself in the space as someone who cares about my team, and I don't, to mine. Anyone who's like talking about how much they hated working for me, and I'm very prompt with my invoices. And so I think that people feel comfortable with that now, but when, when I was first starting out, I was nervous to ask for it. Like I was like, that's where those first few people I was like, go ahead and like I know how much we're gonna build a client and I want to you're gonna get paid for this retainer project, like, go ahead and Bill me and I'll pay you and then we work against that. But that sucked because those first ones went on my credit card because I had gotten paid from the client yet. And then I spent like the first like three days just being like, oh, about please clear stripe, like checking refreshing my stripe, please clear, please clear. And it just wasn't it didn't like long term Cash Flow Planning, it didn't work out and the way we structure our retainers. So if a client's working with us on retainer, then they have a set amount of hours. So I know the team member will go over that amount. So I put that amount of money away. And then for projects, I budget that and internally, I tell the team like the client, like it's not client facing, but there's just many articles, okay, if we're setting up your money, or your restaurant or whatever, like I know, we've planned out how many hours it will be like, here's your max our budget, if there's something crazy, you need to overwrite, you need approval before going over it. So I set those ahead of time so that everybody knows and then so that way, it's easier for me to pull money out of the invoice and it makes it easier to invoice clients because then their invoice is the same. So they're not like worried about this month is 40 hours. And this one's 20. And this one's 60. Like I try to keep it even.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

Yeah, and there's also I mean, just the consistency of it. All right, for everyone. Yeah. So I feel like the way you're doing it also is a great kind of backstop, to not going over what you can afford to pay. So if the client pays you $1,000 For a retainer, and I've seen this a ton. people let their team kind of run amok on the hours, then they ended up paying the team $950 of that invoice, because they didn't keep it to check on what hours would be, you know, worked and what hours were going to be built and how, what way, and then they don't end up actually making any money as agency or agency owner. And I think that's a huge. That's a huge fault. A lot of times, right. I hear a lot people come and they go, Oh, I've got this agency, and I don't make any money at it. And you're like, Okay, well give me your number. And you're like, Oh, God, you really don't make any money. How, why are you doing this? So how do you? How do you? How do you make money here? Are you taking a standard cut? Is it you know, whatever percentage of the hour, you know, the charge client 50 bucks, you're charging them 25? Like you don't to give me your real numbers if you want but how is it a percentage like are you taking heavy work? How does the cut go?

 

Rachel Pereyra  

Yeah, so and this is inside the inner workings, right? So when we work together in a DOO you had a spreadsheet that you gave us to calculate. And so when I originally launched that's what I use. I use I, I've modified it now for like some of the way I mentally think about things, but going into it, and I think the reason why my agency has always been profitable, even if it's not like, I want to preface everything I'm about to say it was saying, I am not sitting here with six figures coming into my bank account, everyone toes in the sand. Okay, so I'll just preface everything about today. But we've been profitable, I haven't been in the red. That's a very big accomplishment. 

 

Kelly Reynolds

That's a big deal. Yeah. 

 

Rachel Pereyra

so going in, I figured out how much time I would have to spend. Like, if I was part of the deliverable, I price it as if I'm paying a deal or subcontractor. Okay, so I've built that in to the retainer. So if it's still me doing it, then I take that home plus my agency and our cut. If it's not me doing it, then I'm just taking the agency owner copies. And I do it like this. So I have, we have our agency rate. And then the team members have their individual rates with some team members cost more something members cost less. But I have the flat rate that I bill. And the goal is to always make enough to cover basic operations, and potentially pay myself some, which I feel like it's a formula that no matter how many people tell you, they'll figure it out, you've never fully like, I feel like I'm always tinkering with it. Like, it's always like, what percentage was where and then because it depends on other things you're investing in internally. So like, when I was looking at what numbers I would need to have to bring in my own DOO and ops manager to help me manage stuff and like, bring in more marketing support for me, you know, like, all of those pieces have to come out of it. And those can fluctuate your operating expenses, but I run very lean for the size of my agency. I think we're just under now the coaching is done. We're under $2,000 a month and like internal running the business expenses, which is very, very lean. Yeah. And I'm trying to keep it that. That's the goal. But that means that's my time. So instead of my money going out, it's my time going out to keep the agency going. So that's something that like a caveat to note for those listening. It's either gonna be running or your time

 

Kelly Reynolds  

Yeah, and which one do you have more of like, in the beginning, you have more time, right? You can hustle, you can learn the thing, you can do the thing. And then after a while, it becomes detrimental for you to be doing it when somebody else can be doing it cheaper and faster. Because we always think we're the greatest at it. And then somebody else comes in, you're like, Oh, crap, why have I been doing this for so many months? That you should be doing this all the time, right? That happens to me, and I'm like, Jesus, why am I why am I touching all the things right? Get them like, and my team, if they're listening to this is like, yes. Can you get out the way? Because like you were saying when you're building these packages, and you're saying, Okay, well, right now, I'm the DOO that's doing the work. But I want to be able to have one day someone else be in that role. So I need to make sure that it is it's a good rate that I can hire someone. And so I love that you're looking at that forward motion of okay, this is what we're doing. But I'm building for the future so that this is already built in, because a lot of people don't. And then they get six months in, and they have to like double their rates, because now they realize they haven't made $1. And then they have pissed off clients, when if they're kind of building an end ahead of time and saying, Okay, well, I need to take agency cut for operations, I need to take my cut as a manager of this whole shebang. And then the DOO was gonna pay for something. And then I've got to pay a contractor as a VA, like all of those people get a cut of this. And I think that that is what a lot of people like kind of leave out when they're pricing. They're like, Well, I'm, you know, I'm a VA agency. And this person's not gonna pay any more than this for VA. But they're not paying for a VA, they're paying for a managed team with a VA, right? You're getting all the management and the services and the software on the things right, you've already done it the experience. So having all of that built out means that you are ready to grow, where other people would have to make a big mess, and piss off a whole bunch of people. So good job.

 

Rachel Pereyra 

Thank you. I appreciate that. That's my former agency coach, I appreciate it.

 

Kelly Reynolds  

Very proud. And I love that you just brought up that spreadsheet. When they were in the I was trying to explain numbers. And it's hard to talk numbers, especially to non-numbers people, like Rachel is but when you're trying to like explain that concept of like everyone gets their cut and what that is, and I made this like basic spreadsheet, it was like here, and it was just like an example of showing something out. And it's just really cute that used it and I love it. And now I'm writing it down because I was like, Oh, I wonder if it's in my group program? Because I don't know if I put it in there. But no, I have to because you use it. Alright. That's fantastic. So how do you structure like your your How do you work the team? I'm in a way of Do you have team meetings? Who is delegating the tasks? Are they taking business kind of like do they have their own clients and then taking the business and they're just running it? Or are you having to kind of delegate that work out? Is it a project management tool slack? Like how are you kind of structuring the team communications?

 

Rachel Pereyra

So I'm obsessed with slack I actually pay for slack premium because I'm obsessed. It's expensive, but I love it. Being able to send audio notes and I what we do is so in the internal structure of my slack I have private channels that are for me When involved in a client project, so for example, when we do larger projects with organizations where we're maybe like hiring people, tech and processes, that's more than one team member. So we'll have an internal channel where all of us are that the client isn't. And then we'll have a channel with the client so that they can reach the team. And we can all correspond. And of course, I'm in all of those. So I can see what's going on. Because I'm, you know, I’m me.

 

Kelly Reynolds  

you haven't gotten out of it yet. Yet. Well, and,

 

Rachel Pereyra 

and that's the piece like, I, that's what I tell my clients to is, like, I like to do the surprise and delight piece of client experience. And so like, even the projects that I'm not directly mobile, the deliverables every now and then I'll pop in the slack and be like, hey, what do you do this weekend? Like, how did you have a great weekend, and like, those little things make a difference in your client experience. And so if I'm not in the Slack channel, I can't do that. And I also, it also helps me see like, it's a good way to see if there's coaching moments for the team, or if there's moments where like, I would have done that differently. Especially in my first year growth phase, like I everyone I hired, I was like, you're building this with me. So this ever let's just fix the squeaky wheel like, let's where is it? Like, you know, that kind of collaborative work? So with client work, we have a few different because I have so many offers, it's not an easy, clear answer. We have retainer work in project work. So for retainer work, that team member, it's pretty much their client, like me or another duo has come in and like worked with the client a little bit with a strategic plan will be are available for like larger scale, like thinking issues or team problems. But they're open, they're assigned OBM is like that's their person, they manage the client, they send me three reports that I review. They have a click up space where we make the client SOP, just in case something happens to them and they're sick or something. Yeah, it's like this, what my anxiety is like a good thing because I'm like, oh, man, this case scenario, and then my business brain is like, good idea.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

Right? Like that's, it's like a superpower. And like you can't ever sleep, right? Yeah, yeah,

 

Rachel Pereyra

yeah, no. So they do that. And then we have monthly all team meetings. And then once a month, I'm not meeting with each of them for 15 minutes. It's just like a check in. I personally hate meetings, which I know is ironic. So we're gonna usually, but we do a lot of slack check in. So like, I'll be like, audio notes. I talked to every team member on my team, every week, I make a conscious effort to reach out to everyone, not maybe not my copywriter, like you're gonna touch my copywriter every week. But I talked to like the ones who if you have a client, and you're working for me, and you're working with one of my clients, like we've talked every week, and I'm just like, how are you? How are things? How's it going? What's up? And so that's how I stay on top of everything. So that I know what's going on. Because like, the thing that wakes me up in the middle of the night, and this is what I'm still working on is like, oh my god, is that thing done? Is it done? Like, I'm not in that client project? Like I don't know what's happening? What if it's not done doing? Panic? I've so I've set up things to help. So when I have those middle of the night wake ups, I can cold sweat. I'm like, oh my god, I can just go in and look up and see. Okay, this is where the status and everything is.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

People at 3 am. Yeah, you know

 

Rachel Pereyra  

what's happening, you can see the weekly progress reports like, and then when I get really nervous, my team knows there's a couple, one of my project leads Monica, I'll just let her and be like, hey, so I'm having a panicky agency owner moment, can you just like update me on this client? And then she'll just update me? And it's like, not a big deal. And I appreciate?

 

Kelly Reynolds

Yeah, yes. Especially if I feel like the newer clients where I can. I wasn't in there all the time. It's I was like, Okay, well, here, I've done the strategy. Here you go. And then I'm good, because they're gonna take care of it, and they're on it. But the ones that are my longtime clients, it's like, okay, I have to be in there. Like, I have to that. My first VA clients six and a half years ago, is still my client. OBM we run a lot of things now for him, but I was the one. So there was a time or two that I get a message in there. Like you're the I don't even know what he's talking about. You're the only one who'll know. And that's fine. Because it's a long term client, like I am the vault of knowledge in that. So I feel like it's harder on those things. Because you're sitting there because you know, the project and you're like, Oh, God, oh, god, did that get done that good luck. The newer ones, it's easier. I feel like for anyone's who's having a hard time giving up that kind of control, which I think is the hardest thing in an agency is letting go of that control. And getting further and further away and letting people do their jobs. That is like so I love that we're bringing it up because it is the hardest thing and it's the thing that everyone freaks out about, but they're going to touch my stuff. Yeah, can't handle it. Right. It's the hardest part. Right? They're just stuff, they're gonna mess up my client.

 

Rachel Pereyra

Well, it is and I was and I went into it. And I was like, you know, I was prepared for this. I had the right mindset. I was like, they're experts. Like, I'm going to trust them. And then they would do something like that. I wouldn't have said it that way. But then like, even when I sit down to like consult before I do any kind of “coaching'' with a team member, I think for what I want to say. So if I'm going to ask Do a correction and like, well, what's the crushing it is I would reread it and I literally would have changed like this, like, not something super, super, like, you know, we're attentive here. And so I'm like, okay, so this is probably not me bringing up to them, because I'm just seeing me write this out again. And so it was like that moment. That was, I agree, that was really hard. It was a hard hurdle to be like, okay, they know what they're doing. I don't happen to know best about every single thing ever.

 

Kelly Reynolds  

Right. And for my husband to be editing this, I doesn't account for you, I do know better and my marriage, but in business business is different. And I do have ideas that maybe are not the best sometimes like, and I think that the more you bring on team members, that Excel, you start to realize that maybe you're not the greatest at everything in the world. And maybe other people can do better than you. Or like you said, like, it wasn't exactly what you would have done. But it was a great result. So like, I don't need to correct them. I don't need to have that kind of bad. Coming down on them all the time as a team, like I really am trying to empower them to make these decisions without me. So being a nitpicker, it's counter productive.

 

Rachel Pereyra

I don't I don't know about you. But I think the most guidance that I have been for my team is around the mindset of managing the client relationship and the sense of not take so Okay, so the clients struggles and worries like they're having a low sales month, like not taking that energy on as a service writer, because this is what we're responsible for. This is what we can control. This is what our deliverable is, of course, we want our clients to succeed. But at the end of the day, like it's not your business, it's their business. And so they need to make certain decisions, they need to do certain things as a business owner, you we're here to support to guide to execute, but you cannot run their business for them. And that's something that I learned very difficult. Very difficult. That's the word now, as a solopreneur was I would take that energy on like, I would be out here, I would be on like when I was in Facebook groups, and I would see like, oh, like someone who's an accountant. So I'd like I'd be like, Oh my God, have you heard this client? Right? Like, I'm like, selling for my clients. I'm like, we need to make this one. And I realized that that's not one that's not my job. And two, that's not my job. And three, that’s not my job.. So like, like learning that I think that's been something that I have provided a lot for my team, it's been less about, like, how do I approach this project management task? Or how do I deal with this team of or it's more of like a, I'm stressed out to the gills and not sleeping? Like what? And I'm like, Whoa, why are we stressed? Why are we so stressed, like, Let's talk it through and then really working with them on not owning, like, it's not your business, like we're here to help we're here to support this is, this is my online business management Hill, I'm gonna die on. It's not my business. I want to support you, I want to help you, I want you to succeed. And it's not that I don't care. But at the end of the day, like, I've had a I had a client as a solopreneur, who paid my retainer. And then I was managing her accounting firm. And she just like, didn't answer me for three months. Like, I was just like, I was leading the team, I was leading the client, deliverables, and like, I'm not an accountant. And it's like, those experiences have made me very, very clear with clients now, like, we want you to win. I am 100% your cheerleader. And if I see someone needed an accountant, your account, I'm gonna tag you, because that's how I am. But I refuse to decide what your offer should be priced at. That's your decision. Like, there's some of these things that you have to decide as a business owner. And I think it's important for those of us, especially in operations, not to get caught holding that bag, like because it's so easy. And so I think for me, that's been the biggest thing that I've worked on with my team.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

Yeah, I feel like there are definitely some times where I have cared more than the business owner about their business. And then you just you're like, but but we you're gonna miss out on this or your, your, your, your don't care or work, this can be more efficient, and, and I get more upset about it, and they don't care. And you're right, I had to learn that very quickly, because I stressed myself out. And I think it's also important as agency owners to tell our team, it's okay not to lose their minds over business, right? Because they want to do a really great job for you. My big thing is that I want to be there, my team's favorite client. They're all contractors, they all have their own businesses, but I want to be their favorite client, I pay them on time. I pay them fairly, if not better than fairly. I take care of them all that kind of stuff. I want to be their favorite client. But that also means that I won't let the clients drive my team crazy. Yep. That's so important because we want to do such a good job and we want the client to be happy, but we sometimes I feel like agency owners forget that they have to take care of their team or they're going to leave and there's an there's a conversation around over like a turnover because they're not being treated well. They're not being paid well. And you know, why are they leaving people leave so often. And I think a lot of that is the backup knowing that the team is backed up by the owner. And they are being taken care of in that way, and they want to be here. So speaking about that, how do you pick people for your team? Do you have because you're much more HR than I am? Yeah, I am like I tried doing the rubrics and all the things. How do you pick? Is it very staged out HR? Like structure to onboard and and to pick your team? Like, how do you do that?

 

Rachel Pereyra 

I am so glad you're asking this question. So yes people, people is my favorite area of ops. I started out, not my first agency, but as a service writer, hiring people who I'd like met and I did an interview, I was like, Oh, you're great, we'll get along. And we weren't a good fit for each other, like long term. And so I learned that painful lesson then. So going into the agency, every role I've had, I've made like, I've done a job op, application interview process. And like really interview people, like when I hired when I hired Heather, my Operations Coordinator. She was my first interview. And I knew when I interviewed her, I was like, I really liked her. I really liked her. But I was like, no, no, I owe it to myself to talk to more people. And I want to come back and hiring her. And we joke about it now, because she's been with me for like nine months, and we're coming up on our year anniversary. But we joke about it now. But like I told my team, like even when I do have internal like management roles open. And so my subcontractors have expressed interest in like being a do over the agency. Like I love all of you, I know what you're capable of. But I owe it to myself and to the business to honor my hiring process to make sure I'm finding the best person for this role. So I do the application screens, like skill level like And granted, of course, you can always say whatever you want an application, but I asked them, if there's something specific that needs like, cooking up experience, or whatever, like I put that in there. And then the interview is to gauge personality fit for me and for the clients that I know we work with. So like, how will we work well together? I have a rather large team now. So it's like, how will they fit in with each other? Like, how will it work? Because, for me the big thing about the team as I wanted it to be like a mastermind of sorts, so like when one of my team members is working on watching other areas of her own business. And so like she sent her her logos to us, because our thoughts like I want those kinds of things happening. And so you have to be really intentional when you're hiring to create that kind of culture. And so I'm really looking for, like personality, fit ability fit. Time fit, I tried to be very honest that like our retainer options started working 40 hours a month. But I still sometimes have people who are like, I can only work 20 hours. And I'm like, I love you but need more than that. So it's like having that I do have an intentional hiring process, I guess is the short answer to that.

 

Kelly Reynolds  

Yeah, I feel like you like I do a job application or a job description, because I really think that it's almost less for them. And more for me to say this is your role here. So that it's much more clear expectations. Because I think, one, there's not as much confusion as to what everyone else is doing all day. But there's also like, people want to work. And they want to do a good job. And they need to know what doing a good job is. So they can do it. If you go to work every day, and you have no idea what the standard is, for a quote, good job. You have no idea how to meet that standard. And it's demoralizing. No one wants to work there. So just being you know, yelled at all the time, everything changes all the time, you're not really sure what you do when you started out as a social media person, but now you're doing like invoicing, like, all of that kind of stuff, it creates this chaos, and it's a shit culture. So we are very much on I'm very clear and job descriptions agreed. I don't I don't do seven interviews and rubrics and all that because I would hate to have to do it for myself. I also hire on fit, but very much personality and culture fit first. Because if you're not going to fit in here, it's rough. Like there's seven of us. There's not enormous amount of interaction, because we don't we're not in meetings, everyone's a contractor. So we're not like big meetings all the time. But like, you know, when there's that one person who's really just doesn't fit and you're like, you know, like, it's just it brings the whole game down. Right? And I'm a big proponent of I can teach you a lot of the stuff we need to do. So I am totally fine if you don't have the most experience, unless it's a specific skill. Like I need you to know how to do this, like I need you to do, like my bookkeeper knows how to, you know, do bookkeeping, but other than that, I feel like I can teach a lot of the skills. I can teach you how to use teamwork or whatever, but I can't teach you how to be really detail oriented or follow up on everything all the time or keep me like I feel like those are things that are much more personality driven. Yeah, so I Yeah, I'm with you on that. Like that is so important because the skills you can learn or they can say look, you know, like I'm happily support you while you do this, if you want to go learn more things.

 

Rachel Pereyra

Yep, no, I, I agree. Like, I definitely have spent a lot of my hiring energy on hiring for people who fill places, I feel like I have gaps. So like I, you know, if you're, if you're not great at hiring, like, that's fine, like, that's my special sauce, but like, I need you to be really good at project management because I personally, this my whole thing, I was dragged kicking and screaming through DOO about project management. And that really was telling me the whole time like your project manager, and I was like, No, I'm not. And she's like, Yes, you are. And like, Yes, I can. But it's not like a thing I love. I really like taking it breaking all the tiny little detail pieces, like mapping out a timeline. Yes. Getting into all the tiny little Okay, so this email nice is like, no, that's not my thing. So I hire for that. Because if if you know, if the client needs to find a team member, that's what I'm really good at. And also, there's a lot of parts of this has helped me learn, like what it is I can teach. And what it is, is actually like my soft skill that I can't teach.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

Yeah. And that's what I couldn't be better at it than you are. Right? Like, like, you're just saying, like, there's certain times people come in, you are so much better than I am. Okay, you're gonna do it all from now on. And that is a fantastic feeling like, Oh, my God, because I've sucked at this this whole time. I mean, there's tons of things, especially when you start out by yourself. And then you're kind of trying to keep things in house for financial reasons. Or you're trying to, you know, divert funds to coaching or other programs or investments, and you're doing things and you're like, I am not the greatest at this, or it's just, you're cranking through it, like, oh, and then someone comes along and does it and they do it really well. And you never have to do it again. And that is heaven. That's the easy part of delegating. It's the hard part when you have to like when it's yours, and you like it, and you don't want anyone to touch it. That's the much harder.

 

Rachel Pereyra  

Yeah, no, I agree. And there were times like one of my first team members is a competitive clickup consultant. And so like I had, my agency click up is not like, it's not something I would give a client put it that way. But it's what's worked for my brain. And she was like, oh, we need to change this, we can change this. And like, my first initial reaction was like, Don't touch my clickup. But then it was like, Okay, take a deep breath. And I was like, so I appreciate where you're coming from. But I feel like you're telling me my child is ugly. So I need a second to process this before we go have this conversation. And that's a piece nobody tells you about having team members who are smarter than you is like, it's hard. And actually, that's a lesson I learned in corporate when I first started managing the finance office, a PM that I met at the team, and he's like, How's hiring going? We were talking about it. And I was like, and I was like, I like to hire people that I can mentor. And he's like, why don't you hire people who are better video. And I was like, um, that feels like a trap. And he's like, hire people who are better than you because they're gonna make you be better. And that's, that's been my mindset coming into the agency. I'm like, I want you to be better than me. Like,

 

Kelly Reynolds  

And that's hard, ego wise. Right? I feel like there is an enormous amount, especially in the last couple of months where like, all hell's broken loose here. I feel like the mindset work that I've been working on for the last couple of years is like, hardcore coming in now. Yep. Like, letting people do things like I had 400 hours booked in June, there's no way I could have done that myself. Like, I physically could not have like, I had to trust someone else, who, frankly, was almost brand new. And I was like, Okay, let's see, if you don't mess this up. Right this second like, I was giving her things that were on my plate. So that that were on my own, like my own stuff, so that I could do client work. And then I was like, You're fantastic. And you are doing this better than I am. Why am I in here. And that is a wonderful point. And I think like once you get to that mindset of like having your ego let it be okay for others to be better than you at these things. It's, it's so much easier. But your ego gets in the way. And you're like, like you said, you're telling me my kids ugly, like, like, oh, and that's too hard. It's hard. Like that makes the mindset work is so much of this. Like, it's because business is it's a mindfuck, right? Like, you you really constantly like, right, you're constantly like, I'm gonna put out posts, and people are gonna make fun of me, or I'm gonna put up posts and no one's gonna care. I'm going to do this work. And it's like, everything is mindset about it. Not just falling into a ball on the floor crying sometimes. And I think that we all still do. Not that we don't really talk about it. But I think that we all still are like losing our minds. I'm sure if like, you can interview my husband. And he'd be like, oh, yeah, she's a disaster at the time, or I have to come in and vent to him just to get it. Like I'm trying. I'm trying not to vent to him because the poor man, but you know what I mean? Like, like, all of that energy. It's all this mindset work of like, I am good at this. I can sell this like, it's all hard. And I think that's really kind of brings us back to where we started but

 

Rachel Pereyra 

My wife doesn't take me seriously anymore. Man. I'm having those entrepreneur lows as I finally call them, because she's like, I know there's gonna end you're gonna achieve some kind of achievement is going to make you excited and you're gonna be all excited about It like, the first six months was really hard. And you know, we would go through those together and I'd be like, all freaking out about like, am I going to sell this? Is someone gonna sign this? Can I deliver this all freaking out about everything? And now she's just like, she's just like still playing her game on her phone and like, yep, yep, yep. Because she knows she's like, You're gonna be fine. I know, you're gonna be fine. Like, it's like part of when when are you going to know you're?

 

Kelly Reynolds

I need to freak out first, and then I can breathe. And then I can be like, well, of course, I'm gonna figure it out. I always figure it out. But there is a process you have to freak out for sometimes. Yep. So what makes your agency different, Rachel? 

 

Rachel Pereyra 

Hmm. I think it's a few pieces, I think one of them is that I, I really am good at holding my team's boundaries. And even coming up with new ones that they don't have that they should. So there's there's that I'm really invested in each of them individually. So there's an element that every member of my team has taken advantage of, in some way, shape, or form for the most part of like, almost like Coach sculpting for like, you know, like a mentorship. And I think from I haven't worked for an agency. So I don't know, but from some of the elements who've worked for other agencies sets me apart, because when I asked you how you're doing, I really mean how are you? Not just like, how's my work? I'm like, how are you? And so when team members have had, you know, losses or illnesses or something like, I'm the person who will send you and if you live in this day, it's an Instacart, or like chicken soup. Like, that's an I try to pay attention. And I think that really makes a difference. Also in our deliverables. So like, all of our clients are like, wow, like, everybody really cares, everybody really shows up, everyone's responsive. And I really know it's because of the energy that I put into nurturing the team individually, so that they can put that out for the clients. And I think that really sets us apart. And the fact that everybody's an expert in something, so like, everyone on my team is literally expert level in something. And so I can tap into that for our clients. So they really feel that difference. I think that's what really sets us apart.

 

Kelly Reynolds

Yeah, and I think that energy, you can totally feel that as a client, you know, like, they know, they know that we're going to show up, and we're going to be there and right? Where we are, the person is going to take care of it all. And they can rely on us because we can rely on our team. And, and that becomes a big problem when that culture isn't there. And that's when you get that turnover, and then you can't rely on people and then and then and then right and then it's chaos. Taking care of people is a big deal. Hear me people, it is a big deal.

 

Rachel Pereyra

It is invest your time and energy into it and money. Like I made a post about this credit note months ago. And I was like, your team loves you checking on them. And they love you remembering your dog's name. They love your money more. So like, you know, a cards nice, but I asked all my team members, similarly to my clients, when they start I'm like, What is your love language? Like how do you prefer and I make money a drop down option they can select because I think people are like nervous to put money in. But if I made it an option, choose it. And I have to remember who that's all just so you know, instead of sending you a birthday card, and I'll just pay pal you know, $25 bucks or something, go get a coffee, like you like money. Here's your money,

 

Kelly Reynolds

right? Like some people like a big beautiful box of something they'll never buy for themselves. And some people want cash because they're saving for something, or they're, you know, preschools expensive or like all those kinds of things. Yeah, I think that's really important. And just that is my favorite part of my agency is being able to have like this, this group of women that I can chat with, you know, like, it's hard sitting in this office by myself all the time. Because Brian doesn't want to talk about this all the time. You know what I mean? Like he's, yeah, he's had enough of my freakout. You know what I mean? So like, being able to have like, you know, watercooler talk, like there's not Well, that's the thing you don't get in court, you don't get when you leave corporate, is you don't get to walk over someone else's desk and tell him about what you like what you did yesterday. So that having that team and having that kind of friendship there. It's my favorite part. Because you get to be professional, and I love helping them with their businesses as well. That's, that's great part. Okay, Rachel, I have had such a fantastic time seeing your face, although nobody else can see your face. Just me, I can see it. I have added the vest on and talking to you today. And why don't you tell everyone where they can find you?

 

Rachel Pereyra 

Yeah, yeah. So I'm at mastermind Business Services everywhere or  at Rachel Pereyra.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

Awesome. I will put that all in the show notes as well. So you guys can find Rachel and you should definitely go find Rachel. And Rachel, thank you so much for being here.

 

Rachel Pereyra 

Thank you. This has been so fun. I love this conversation.

 

Kelly Reynolds 

And I will see everyone else next week.